Saints hammered by NFL
- Thread starter Sgt John
- Start date
Remote Controller
Well-Known Member
You have the right to your opinion. I have the right to not agree with it.
Haven't been involved with this, but I wonder if your paranoia medicine is running out? :dunno:
If you honestly believe this was soley done ONLY to get the Saints, you are mistaken.
Yes, other teams have had bounties, as quoted by alot of players it was player driven not program driven. One other key area that you seem to miss is for three years they were WARNED to stop by the league. They never did, and in fact lied about stopping. THAT is why they were targeted, and other teams were not. Like it, don't like it, I don't care. But at least know the facts before you come up with some of this :bs:
gizzil
Well-Known Member
who else was warned to stop? did they? didnt they? we'll never know. you cant know - thats why you are full of :bs: - what the **** are you talking about facts? my facts are straight actually - and you have proved my point yet again in your own attack - and i quote
" THAT is why they were targeted, and other teams were not."
so, once again - they were targeted, and you yourself are hereby admitting it. wow, you guys struggle haha
" THAT is why they were targeted, and other teams were not."
so, once again - they were targeted, and you yourself are hereby admitting it. wow, you guys struggle haha
Remote Controller
Well-Known Member
Pull together some facts then try again.
gizzil
Well-Known Member
what facts need to be pulled together? where are the facts that other teams were investigated? im fine with the facts i know - by the way, what are your facts, exactly? the reports? i just said theres no way to know who else was investigated, to what degree, or what they were told to do and not do. that information does not exist... sooo... uh we actually only know, and can know the same "facts" - the reports that we've all read - you can both get off your high horse... none of us are **** - all any of us will ever know is what the league and the media decide to tell us - we all have the same information - dont act like you know more
Last edited by a moderator:
Remote Controller
Well-Known Member
Numbers essential to this story continue to escape you. 16,000......50,000....3 years of lying. This all led to 1 year, 8 games, 6 games, $500,000, 2 second rounders and hopefully an indefinite supension that becomes LIFE for a DC that crossed a line most people understand.
gizzil
Well-Known Member
uh... ok... I know all these numbers... what is your point exactly? what of these numbers have a failed to use? and this is relative to me pointing out that the saints were singled out... because... why? exactly? i said the saints were singled out. you both actually have already agreed with me. i dont see why or what these numbers have to do with it - i did know them though, so.. i guess they didnt really escape me at all, did they? what escapes me is why you continue to return to numbers that we all already know - not a secret - maybe you think somehow by revisiting the same tired numbers you are explaining WHY the saints were singled out? i could give a **** why honestly - i just said that they WERE singled out - WHY doesnt matter in that context - at all. so you can keep telling me the why all you want, i already know all these things
Remote Controller
Well-Known Member
I rest my case your honor.
gizzil
Well-Known Member
my conclusion: the saints were singled out, that sucks
yours: the saints were singled out because....
you've already ceded my first argument
mine: i think this unfair as all the other teams have similar programs
yours: none of the other teams had programs like this
so where does the burden of proof lie? you say they dont have programs like this? a statement that can never be affirmed or refuted... hmm... pretty ****ing weak if you ask me... and not at all surprising
yours: the saints were singled out because....
you've already ceded my first argument
mine: i think this unfair as all the other teams have similar programs
yours: none of the other teams had programs like this
so where does the burden of proof lie? you say they dont have programs like this? a statement that can never be affirmed or refuted... hmm... pretty ****ing weak if you ask me... and not at all surprising
Remote Controller
Well-Known Member
Saints are guilty as charged!
gizzil
Well-Known Member
wow adding the answers in the quote huh... ok so once again you prove that you do not understand the argument - let's walk you through this...
my conclusion: it's wrong? they were clearly singled out - the definition of singled out is that other teams did the same thing, yet only one was punished - so no, actually you're wrong
it's not my favorite line - you just do it over and over - your lack of imagination and of any sort of argument whatsoever (spitting facts does not qualify as an argument - sorry, i know you haven't grasped that yet, but, maybe one day you will) forces me to point out over and over that you are agreeing with me. If you dont get it the first three times - im guessin you wont - im sorry your processes of cognition do not alow you to see what lies in plain sight - feel sorry for you, really.
Lack the facts: HAHA - ok... so they wrote up a buncha pages on one team? where are the rest of the pages having to do with other teams? my point was that there are no other "facts" and why? because the penalties are going to a single team... because... why now? they are being singled out.
other teams didnt have programs like this? please... who's naive again?
it's "bear" and not "bare" actually. (again, not very surprising) and failed? failed what? what proof do i need to say that the saints were singularly charged for an act every team participates in? that i dont have documents implicating other teams' bounty programs? i dont have those pages. but if you've been paying any attention to any level of football anywhere... you know that every team has a similar program - it's just true... do i really hafta document that? so many people here even gave examples from pee wee and hs squads already. shall i reference the "Bounty Bowls" of 1989? any ryan defense since? honestly i mustve given too much credit i assumed everyone knew these programs existed.
my conclusion: it's wrong? they were clearly singled out - the definition of singled out is that other teams did the same thing, yet only one was punished - so no, actually you're wrong
it's not my favorite line - you just do it over and over - your lack of imagination and of any sort of argument whatsoever (spitting facts does not qualify as an argument - sorry, i know you haven't grasped that yet, but, maybe one day you will) forces me to point out over and over that you are agreeing with me. If you dont get it the first three times - im guessin you wont - im sorry your processes of cognition do not alow you to see what lies in plain sight - feel sorry for you, really.
Lack the facts: HAHA - ok... so they wrote up a buncha pages on one team? where are the rest of the pages having to do with other teams? my point was that there are no other "facts" and why? because the penalties are going to a single team... because... why now? they are being singled out.
other teams didnt have programs like this? please... who's naive again?
it's "bear" and not "bare" actually. (again, not very surprising) and failed? failed what? what proof do i need to say that the saints were singularly charged for an act every team participates in? that i dont have documents implicating other teams' bounty programs? i dont have those pages. but if you've been paying any attention to any level of football anywhere... you know that every team has a similar program - it's just true... do i really hafta document that? so many people here even gave examples from pee wee and hs squads already. shall i reference the "Bounty Bowls" of 1989? any ryan defense since? honestly i mustve given too much credit i assumed everyone knew these programs existed.
jjtweeks
Moderator
When someone goes into a lineup when they commit a crime and they are "singled out" it is not due to any sort of unfairness but rather the fact that they are guilty. Not much difference here. There is not near the amount of "evidence" against any other team as there is against the Saints right now and they will properly(imo) be made an example of. I think the "numbers and facts" do play a huge role here because they are pretty much evidence and Williams and the Saints kept written records of this which kinda makes it like organized crime(please don't take this part out of context). Yes, maybe some others teams do something similar but to say all is pure speculation which as we all know does not carry any weight. And the similarities have not shown to any degree the way Williams(especially) and the Saints operated this sort of "program".
Your right that a storm is probably coming but it will be weathered as others have.
On a side note lets try to keep our attacks on the issue and not get to close to a personal level but still keep it interesting and relevant.
Your right that a storm is probably coming but it will be weathered as others have.
On a side note lets try to keep our attacks on the issue and not get to close to a personal level but still keep it interesting and relevant.
Allow me to please summarize the opposing opinion.
Yes, other teams have done this, players have come out and said so. NFL had to know.
Yes, the Saints were the only NFL team to be punished.
No, they were not "singled out" or "targeted"
Yes, they had stiff penalties levied, why? They were told to stop, and they refused to do so, lying in the process to the NFL.
Were other teams warned? Don't know. However, in all previous information from players, even retired players, it was player pools, not pools supplied and paid for by coaches. Also the $$ were no where near the amounts the Saints used.
Now, you will post again, that this is no evidence. Why? Cause you like to stick your head in the sand.
You can't prove anything on your end other than YOUR supposition. I at least can pull quotes from multiple players again including retired players that verify what we the opposition believe.
Net, you don't have a leg to stand on.
Thanks for playing.
Yes, other teams have done this, players have come out and said so. NFL had to know.
Yes, the Saints were the only NFL team to be punished.
No, they were not "singled out" or "targeted"
Yes, they had stiff penalties levied, why? They were told to stop, and they refused to do so, lying in the process to the NFL.
Were other teams warned? Don't know. However, in all previous information from players, even retired players, it was player pools, not pools supplied and paid for by coaches. Also the $$ were no where near the amounts the Saints used.
Now, you will post again, that this is no evidence. Why? Cause you like to stick your head in the sand.
You can't prove anything on your end other than YOUR supposition. I at least can pull quotes from multiple players again including retired players that verify what we the opposition believe.
Net, you don't have a leg to stand on.
Thanks for playing.
JScott
Administrator
My 2 cents...
NO was singled out, but not "targeted". They made their own bed, not Goodell. Their program was different than others, being run by coaches. They were warned to stop, possibly as other teams were. NO/Payton lied that there was no program by some accounts and that it had stopped by others. This was discovered not to be the case. Hammer comes down.
IMO with all the other players saying bounty programs (at a smaller level) exist I assume warnings were sent to other teams besides NO as well. Meaning at the beginning NO wasn't singled out but due to the level and the lying which they appear to be the only team to do so, they were singled out in the end. Do I know this for sure, of course not, we don't know one way or the other about the other 31 teams. They could have all been warned and stopped or none of them could have been warned.
The bottom line is Goodell did not single NO out, they singled themselves out by their own actions and lack of.
NO was singled out, but not "targeted". They made their own bed, not Goodell. Their program was different than others, being run by coaches. They were warned to stop, possibly as other teams were. NO/Payton lied that there was no program by some accounts and that it had stopped by others. This was discovered not to be the case. Hammer comes down.
IMO with all the other players saying bounty programs (at a smaller level) exist I assume warnings were sent to other teams besides NO as well. Meaning at the beginning NO wasn't singled out but due to the level and the lying which they appear to be the only team to do so, they were singled out in the end. Do I know this for sure, of course not, we don't know one way or the other about the other 31 teams. They could have all been warned and stopped or none of them could have been warned.
The bottom line is Goodell did not single NO out, they singled themselves out by their own actions and lack of.