Pass Defenses

[ExperiencedRookie]

Outlawz!! I need your help again. Just like with the run defenses, I now need your expert input on pass defense.

What team additions/subtractions will play a big part in the pass defense of NFL teams? Consider not only the secondary, but also the strength of a team's pass rush with new players in the front 7.

Also consider change of scheme and new or lost coaches.

What is the impact of a team changing from a 4-3 to a 3-4?

I'll get us started with my favorite offseason move and that's Albert Haynesworth. He's taking his 8.5 sacks last year over to Washington now. Washington pass rush up, Tennessee pass rush down.

Sticking with these same 2 teams, Tenn has also lost their D coordinator which could cause another small drop.

On the Washington side, they also added DeAngelo Hall, who if he plays to his talent level, can be a game changing CB. I'm not totally sold on his attitude and work ethic, so I won't be making this a huge boost, but a boost non the less.

 

[WesDawg]

Don't forget Washington stole Orakpo on draft day. I know you're not leaning hard on rookie additions, but combining that with the Haynesworth signing is notable.

I'll give you the most recent major acquisition. Greg Ellis to Oakland. How can this not pay off when this defense already boasted one of the sole remaining true "lockdown" CB's in the league in Asomugha? And they now have to gameplan for Kyle Orton as opposed to Jay Cutler.

 

[ExperiencedRookie]

Don't forget Washington stole Orakpo on draft day. I know you're not leaning hard on rookie additions, but combining that with the Haynesworth signing is notable.

I'll give you the most recent major acquisition. Greg Ellis to Oakland. How can this not pay off when this defense already boasted one of the sole remaining true "lockdown" CB's in the league in Asomugha?

Small consideration for Orakpo, but don't expect me to hump the leg of a rookie too hard. :hitit2:

As far as Ellis, how big of a bump do you consider him in the pass defense game?

 

[WesDawg]

You can decide that for yourself based on how heavily you weight a pass rush in your rankings.

Their unit was a fairly respectable one last year if I recall correctly, so adding an established pass rusher when there was not one before should be worth maybe 2 spots, I suppose.

 

[ExperiencedRookie]

You can decide that for yourself based on how heavily you weight a pass rush in your rankings.

Their unit was a fairly respectable one last year if I recall correctly, so adding an established pass rusher when there was not one before should be worth maybe 2 spots, I suppose.

I would say that a marquee pass rusher would add quite a bit. Anyone averaging 7 sacks a year over a long period of time is certainly a nice addition.

Good 1 Wes.

 

[WesDawg]

Thanks. 7 sacks/year may not seem like a huge deal, but when compared to what they had before it certainly can't hurt.

Have you considered Miami? They went extremely defensive backfield heavy in the draft, plus resigned Taylor.

Brady's return and Buffalo adding T.O. may offset those facts, though.

 

[ExperiencedRookie]

Have you considered Miami? They went extremely defensive backfield heavy in the draft, plus resigned Taylor.

Brady's return and Buffalo adding T.O. may offset those facts, though.

Ah, I hadn't thought about Taylor. At his age, what is his impact?

 

[ExperiencedRookie]

As I prepare last year's numbers I'm shocked at a few teams.

San Diego, Chicago, Seattle, NYJ, and ESPECIALLY Arizona were awful last year against the pass.

Can anyone make a case for player improvements for any of these teams?

 

[WesDawg]

The Jets jump out. Bart Scott (LB), Lito Sheppard (CB), Jim Leonhard (S), and a head coach that was the mastermind behind Baltimore's dominant defenses of the past decade.

Arizona acquired Bryant McFadden from Pittsburgh and lost Rod Hood (a liability).

SD gets Merriman back healthy.

I can't think of anything impactful that isn't draft-related for Chicago or Seattle off the top of my head. Although Seattle's trade of J.Peterson takes one of the best pass-defending LB's in the league off their roster.

 

[ExperiencedRookie]

The Jets jump out. Bart Scott (LB), Lito Sheppard (CB), Jim Leonhard (S), and a head coach that was the mastermind behind Baltimore's dominant defenses of the past decade.

Arizona acquired Bryant McFadden from Pittsburgh and lost Rod Hood (a liability).

SD gets Merriman back healthy.

I can't think of anything impactful that isn't draft-related for Chicago or Seattle off the top of my head. Although Seattle's trade of J.Peterson takes one of the best pass-defending LB's in the league off their roster.

So Seattle looks to be the only team who didn't improve their pass defense in this off-season.

NYJ looks to take the sharpest rise of any of those teams. So many additions and a defensive coach will give them a big boost.

I'm going to go back and look at SD's numbers against the pass from 07 when Merriman was healthy to gauge where they should be placed. I won't put them back where they were in 07 though because of the recovery speed of his injury. Not sure if he will be the same player in 09.

 

[ExperiencedRookie]

Julian Peterson to the Lions along with the rest of their off-season acquisitions. Where does that put Detroit in 09?

 

[Coachnorm]

I understand why you would make this conclusion. However, Detroit played those same teams/Rbs last year(nfc North), so why should that be a drop for their ranking when those circumstances didn't change?
Offseason additions aren't always easy to handicap, however I do like the additions on D for the Lions. Buchanon is an upgrade over Travis Fisher (I meet him personally, very good person) Larry Foote, will help 3-4 transition, Julian Peterson (another quality LB to help with the 3-4 and the subtraction of Corey Redding!) and Grady Jackson(veteran DL). Also, they were epically bad last year on defense and across the board. I'd have to optimistically hope that the men in that locker room and new additions wont have any part of the pity party that existed last year. 24 ppg is a possibility if not a probability. Dont forget Shwartcz or w/e his name is came from the Titans, one of the best 3-4 D's last year.
-Bayton


I brought this Bayton response over to here because it was excellent and appropriate for this thread too because he addressed the whole D. It is hard to sepearte run D from pass D completely, obviously.

He is right that offseason additions are hard to handicap before the final product hits the field. This year the Lions have brought in a lot of potential upgrades on the D but the proof is in the puddding ultimately. The Lions at the very least made almost every D position up for competition. I Hope to see 3-4 new faces in the actual lineup and 3-4 players who are better from being actively pushed to start in camp. How this exactly plays out remains to be seen. This could be merely a tranformation from Swiss cheese to American cheese. But little things can make a big difference. A slight uptick in the LB corp could bring very positive results.

Last year the Lions D gave up 2 scores quickly in almost every game. If they were giving 5-6 yards to a RB on first down then they were facing second 5 or 4, not a good senerio for a D. If they give up only 4 yards to a RB this year on first down the D has a much better situation to deal with. But even the O affects the D alot. After piling up a few (?) the O started out games trying not to lose games, be mistake free, and conservative. After they went behind 2 scores then The O went Balls to the wall and performed very good at times. The Lions came back in many games to make a run of it. Hopefully, new coaching brings some more aggressive play calling on O and as a side effect much better production from the D. In my book that whole try and be mistake free on O only really works if you have a top 5 D to work with. Ok, I am rambling around in generalizations here but I am just trying to point out that both sides of the ball has an impact on how each side of the ball performs. The Lions could very well be the most improved team this year (additional wins) and still be in the cellar. I expect the D to be dramaticly improved, in a real football sense, which doesn't always tranlate into stats. But if don't give up some of the long scores and compress well as the field shortens (FGs vs TDs) they could perform very well for what will be a lower ranked D.

 

[DearbornDolfan]

I'm not drinking the Jets' kool-aid on this one. They don't have half the talent nor tenth the experience of last year's Baltimore D. Also, Bart Scott was bragging about how the Jets' D was going to be "violent" and that the AFC East had never seen anything like it. My response to that is he's right, the AFC East has never seen such a potentially disastrous cocktail of inexperience and overenthusiasm.

 

[bodey24]

Dallas should probably drop at least 1 spot with the loss of Greg Ellis as well.

 

[ExperiencedRookie]

I'm not drinking the Jets' kool-aid on this one. They don't have half the talent nor tenth the experience of last year's Baltimore D.

Keep going DD. Make a case for where the NYJ defense should be upgraded/downgraded to. Don't make assumptions either or use your divisional hatred against them.

 

[ExperiencedRookie]

Dallas should probably drop at least 1 spot with the loss of Greg Ellis as well.

He's not the only loss on defense either. They've made a lot of changes. Does Roy moving on upgrade them?

 

[DearbornDolfan]

Their corners are above average, there's no doubt about that. Their safeties really aren't so hot, which is half the equation in Ryan's defense. Their best LB is Bart Scott and I'm not sure what he's going to do without Ray Lewis taking the attention of the offensive line away from him. Kris Jenkins is probably their best defensive player, and while the NT position is important in Ryan's defense the Jets don't have much in the really important areas (safety and linebacker).

 

[ExperiencedRookie]

the Jets don't have much in the really important areas (safety and linebacker).

Dude. Kerry Rhodes? He might not be Ed Reed, but he is still a stud safety.

 

[bodey24]

Roy Williams didn't play last year either so I don't think he should sway their ranking in either direction. They also lost Anthony Henry which I think is a good thing for their pass defense, but with the loss of Greg Ellis they should still drop back a spot or two.

 

[ExperiencedRookie]

Roy Williams didn't play last year either so I don't think he should sway their ranking in either direction. They also lost Anthony Henry which I think is a good thing for their pass defense, but with the loss of Greg Ellis they should still drop back a spot or two.

Good point Bodey.

Noted.

What else ya got?