Phicinfan's Pre-draft Insanity

Phicinfan

Expert on nothing, opinionated on everything
Administrator
Okay, I am not going to go through the process of doing a full first round mock draft. Why? Because it has been my experience that there will be one or two key moves (either a trade you didn't expect, or a player taken too early by someone) that totally changes the expectations.

So, with that in mind, I will post who I think will go, and what I think may happen to spike a normal draft.

Pick #1 Detroit - Matthew Stafford Qb Georgia
You all know how I feel, you build the lines, then look for the talent to run the team and survive. I am not even sold on Stafford, then again I was not sold on Matt Ryan and he worked out fine. Still, Detroit really needs to fix the O-line to make a real run at success. But the pressure to get the young Qb of the future, especially since they have no depth or talent now...will be too great.

Spike - They do the right thing and take Smith. Not a huge effect...but will change the middle of the draft...and make the Jets ecstatic.

Pick #2 St. Louis - Jason Smith OT Baylor
You just lost Pace, and the O-line is a mess, and your Qb is fragile. This is a no brainer. If the pick is not Smith, it will be Monroe.

Spike - They do the unthinkable, and go Stafford or Sanchez to get the future Qb they need, and trade away Bulger due to this inability to stay healthy. If this were to happen, the Jets would be in shock...and wonder what they did to piss off the drafting gods.

Pick #3 Kansas City - Aaron Curry Lb Wake Forest
To me if Stafford and Smith or Monroe are gone...you have two choices here. You go OT with the remaining one left, or you get the best Defender and for that matter best player in the draft. I think Pioli sets a precident here and takes the best player. Curry will make that defense really, really better.

Spike - Not a huge spike but they go Monroe instead. The only issue this would cause is who will deal up to take Curry who is shockingly going to fall now.

Pick #4 Seattle - Eugene Monroe OT Virginia
This right here is where the fun really starts. if Curry is here...the Seahawks start to have a party. The trade offers will come in hot and heavy. I don't think they take him though, as he is a better ILB than an OLB. I also don't think Crabtree is an option, since they just dropped major change on T.J. Houshmanzedah. So to me this is a DL pick or an OL pick. I think Monroe goes here.

Spike - They go Qb here. Holmgren is gone, and Hasselbeck was his guy. Plus Has still has the back concerns. Sanchez will definately be there....possibly Stafford as well. If they do go Qb here...and Stafford and Sanchez are gone you will see two things. You will see Cincy dance like madmen(they will get Monroe.....) and you will see NY Jets panic and make a desperate trade up to get Freeman, which would be a huge mistake.

Pick #5 Cleveland - Michael Crabtree Wr Texas Tech
Cleveland has dealt away there best possession receiver in Soldja Winslow. On top of that, if this is the pick, you will then see a trade to the NY Giants sending Edwards to them for pick #29. They could go D-line here going either Raji or Orakpo. If that were to happen a trade could still happen....if Britt is still there at #29, they could then make the trade with NY Giants. But in my mind they want to totally revamp this team...and they can do it by taking Crabtree, trading away Edwards and move on.

Spike 1 - They go Orakpo, who would meet a huge need on defense for them, and let Crabtree drop. If this happens....Oakland would be doing hand springs....so would Jacksonville.

Spike 2 - The Browns announce two trades. First is Edwards to NY Giants for Pick #29, second is Brady Quinn to either NY Jets for multiple picks, or San Fran or Denver for their first rounder and a later round pick. And then take the Qb left at this point either Sanchez or Stafford. This would ONLY happen if one of the top two Qbs are still there.

Spike 3 - Deal Brady Quinn to NY Jets for multiple picks, still take Crabtree and look to fix D-line later in this draft with the extra picks. This would probably happen if Stafford and Sanchez are gone.

Pick #6 Cincinnati - Andre Smith OT Alabama
Cincy needs O-line depth. They lost their starting ROT to FA to Philly, and the current LOT starter has knee issues. Even if they feel Collins or Whitworth fits at LOT, they still have the hole at ROT. Smith is huge, and could be a solid RT and possibly the LT of the future.

Spike 1 - Monroe is there and cincy happily dances to the beat to take him.

Spike 2 - Crabtree or Curry are there, and they take a trade down so they can still get Smith...and extra picks. This would be the smart thing to do though...so don't hold your breath.

Spike 3 - They shock everyone by taking Crabtree, which then allows them to trade COC to either NY Giants or the Philadelphia Eagles for a late first round pick. They could then address OT there with Britton or Oher or Beatty. This would really spike the draft as Arizona would be screwed by not getting huge picks for Boldin, and being stuck again with a disgruntled player. I would LOVE to see this one. It won't happen, but it would really make the draft fun.

Pick #7 Oakland - Jerry Maclin Wr Missouri
Lets face it, it is a need area. So is O-line, D-line and some other key areas. But with Qb situation now solid (Garcia signing), and a solid running game...they need some receiving talent to help the young Qb.

Spike 1 - They go Raji here to tighten up an already solid Def. No real issues on rest of draft, other than Jags get the Wr they truly need if Crabtree is gone.

Spike 2 - Trade down to Jets to allow the Jets to take Qb they have to get. Whether it is Freeman or Sanchez if still there. Good move for Oakland as they can still get Jerry at Jets pick, or OT possibility as well...and extra picks.

Pick #8 Jacksonville - B.J. Raji DT Boston College
This assumes both Crabtree and Maclin are gone. He is without a doubt the best DT in this draft, and will make the young DEs they took last year even better.

Spike 1 - One or both Wrs are there, and they get the much, much needed Wr they need.

Spike 2 - They need Wr, and trade down to Jets so that Qb can be taken by Jets and they can still get Wr later in Heyward - Bay or Britt or Nicks later at Jets pick.

Pick #9 Green Bay - Brian Orakpo DE/LB Texas
Converting to a 3-4 defense and they need the tweener to do it. Would be a huge help in that transition.

Spike 1 - Take an OT here if Smith is still there. Their line was okay..but it is getting older. Smith would be a solid youth movement.

Spike 2 - Go Cb to fix that issue...so take Jenkins here.



Well that is pretty much the farthest I will go. San Fran will take the best that is left as they have multiple needs...or trade down if Qb is there for Jets to take.
 

ExperiencedRookie

Well-Known Member
Awesome post Phic. Would love to see an entire 1st round done in the manner which you have. Might actually be the best top 10 mock I've seen. Good work.

The spikes might get a little out of control after a while though.
 

WesDawg

'Burghapologist
To me Raji is everything Glenn Dorsey was supposed to be.

I'm divided a bit on that observation, Sarge. Dorsey was a bit more highly regarded entering last year's draft, and he did his college thing against a much higher level of competition. And they'll both end up going within 4 picks of each other, more than likely.

I think Dorsey's going to be fine once they get some other pieces on the defense.
 

Arctic Dawgs

Well-Known Member
Pick #4 Seattle - Eugene Monroe OT Virginia
This right here is where the fun really starts. if Curry is here...the Seahawks start to have a party. The trade offers will come in hot and heavy. I don't think they take him though, as he is a better ILB than an OLB. I also don't think Crabtree is an option, since they just dropped major change on T.J. Houshmanzedah. So to me this is a DL pick or an OL pick. I think Monroe goes here.

Spike - They go Qb here. Holmgren is gone, and Hasselbeck was his guy. Plus Has still has the back concerns. Sanchez will definately be there....possibly Stafford as well. If they do go Qb here...and Stafford and Sanchez are gone you will see two things. You will see Cincy dance like madmen(they will get Monroe.....) and you will see NY Jets panic and make a desperate trade up to get Freeman, which would be a huge mistake.

This right here is where the fun really starts.

Here's why: They could go in one of three directions with their choice -- quarterback, offensive tackle or wide receiver. I'm already on record saying they should take wide receiver Michael Crabtree because he's a playmaker, because he fills a need and because he's one of the top two or three players in this draft. But this is about what the Seahawks think, and what they wind up doing will have a ripple effect on the top 10.
Let's say they decide they must find a successor to Walter Jones at left tackle. Either Jason Smith or Eugene Monroe should be sitting there, with Cleveland and Cincinnati waiting on Seattle's decision. Like most of you, I assume St. Louis takes a tackle -- with Smith a likely target. That would leave Monroe on the board for Kansas City at the third spot or for Seattle at the fourth.
I don't see the Chiefs taking him. In fact, what I do see is the Chiefs trying to bail out of a position they probably can't -- basically because it's so expensive to trade into that spot. Unless you're positively enamored with a player you don't make the move up.

I am scared to death of Detroit going OLine with the #1 pick. Who knows what Seattle or others will do if J.Smith and Monroe are gone

:scared:
 

Phicinfan

Expert on nothing, opinionated on everything
Administrator
Awesome post Phic. Would love to see an entire 1st round done in the manner which you have. Might actually be the best top 10 mock I've seen. Good work.

The spikes might get a little out of control after a while though.
I thought about it. But after the first 10, if any two of those spikes I have listed happen, then every pick from 20 on down will be totally different.

I have the greatest respect for those who can go through and figure out 32 positions. It takes a whole lot of work, and patience. I simply can't do it due to the frustration factor. Too many teams have different values on players, and there is ALWAYS a couple of picks in the top 15 that totally shifts what happens later in the round.
 

Coachnorm

Moderator
I thought about it. But after the first 10, if any two of those spikes I have listed happen, then every pick from 20 on down will be totally different.

I have the greatest respect for those who can go through and figure out 32 positions. It takes a whole lot of work, and patience. I simply can't do it due to the frustration factor. Too many teams have different values on players, and there is ALWAYS a couple of picks in the top 15 that totally shifts what happens later in the round.

Thanks Phicinfan, This is absolutely great. You are right, if just a couple of these spikes happen the rest of the predictions/picks go right down the tube. I have absolute respect for those who try to project an entire round (Khris and Ryan) and stick their views out there for all to see.

That is probably what makes NFL Draft predicting such a fascinating subject to talk about.
 

Phicinfan

Expert on nothing, opinionated on everything
Administrator
I will say this. Depending on how the Qbs fall, my gut tells me the two key places for trades in the top 10 are at 5 and 8.

I do think cleveland deals Edwards, but all i read now is Giants will only deal their 2nd round pick and others.

I also think if Sanchez is there....maybe even if not...Jags deal down to the NYJets for them to get a Qb.
 

Phicinfan

Expert on nothing, opinionated on everything
Administrator
Okay, I am not going to go through the process of doing a full first round mock draft. Why? Because it has been my experience that there will be one or two key moves (either a trade you didn't expect, or a player taken too early by someone) that totally changes the expectations.

So, with that in mind, I will post who I think will go, and what I think may happen to spike a normal draft.

Pick #1 Detroit - Matthew Stafford Qb Georgia
You all know how I feel, you build the lines, then look for the talent to run the team and survive. I am not even sold on Stafford, then again I was not sold on Matt Ryan and he worked out fine. Still, Detroit really needs to fix the O-line to make a real run at success. But the pressure to get the young Qb of the future, especially since they have no depth or talent now...will be too great.

Spike - They do the right thing and take Smith. Not a huge effect...but will change the middle of the draft...and make the Jets ecstatic.

Pick #2 St. Louis - Jason Smith OT Baylor
You just lost Pace, and the O-line is a mess, and your Qb is fragile. This is a no brainer. If the pick is not Smith, it will be Monroe.

Spike - They do the unthinkable, and go Stafford or Sanchez to get the future Qb they need, and trade away Bulger due to this inability to stay healthy. If this were to happen, the Jets would be in shock...and wonder what they did to piss off the drafting gods.

Pick #3 Kansas City - Aaron Curry Lb Wake Forest
To me if Stafford and Smith or Monroe are gone...you have two choices here. You go OT with the remaining one left, or you get the best Defender and for that matter best player in the draft. I think Pioli sets a precident here and takes the best player. Curry will make that defense really, really better.

Spike - Not a huge spike but they go Monroe instead. The only issue this would cause is who will deal up to take Curry who is shockingly going to fall now.

Pick #4 Seattle - Eugene Monroe OT Virginia
This right here is where the fun really starts. if Curry is here...the Seahawks start to have a party. The trade offers will come in hot and heavy. I don't think they take him though, as he is a better ILB than an OLB. I also don't think Crabtree is an option, since they just dropped major change on T.J. Houshmanzedah. So to me this is a DL pick or an OL pick. I think Monroe goes here.

Spike - They go Qb here. Holmgren is gone, and Hasselbeck was his guy. Plus Has still has the back concerns. Sanchez will definately be there....possibly Stafford as well. If they do go Qb here...and Stafford and Sanchez are gone you will see two things. You will see Cincy dance like madmen(they will get Monroe.....) and you will see NY Jets panic and make a desperate trade up to get Freeman, which would be a huge mistake.

Pick #5 Cleveland - Michael Crabtree Wr Texas Tech
Cleveland has dealt away there best possession receiver in Soldja Winslow. On top of that, if this is the pick, you will then see a trade to the NY Giants sending Edwards to them for pick #29. They could go D-line here going either Raji or Orakpo. If that were to happen a trade could still happen....if Britt is still there at #29, they could then make the trade with NY Giants. But in my mind they want to totally revamp this team...and they can do it by taking Crabtree, trading away Edwards and move on.

Spike 1 - They go Orakpo, who would meet a huge need on defense for them, and let Crabtree drop. If this happens....Oakland would be doing hand springs....so would Jacksonville.

Spike 2 - The Browns announce two trades. First is Edwards to NY Giants for Pick #29, second is Brady Quinn to either NY Jets for multiple picks, or San Fran or Denver for their first rounder and a later round pick. And then take the Qb left at this point either Sanchez or Stafford. This would ONLY happen if one of the top two Qbs are still there.

Spike 3 - Deal Brady Quinn to NY Jets for multiple picks, still take Crabtree and look to fix D-line later in this draft with the extra picks. This would probably happen if Stafford and Sanchez are gone.

Pick #6 Cincinnati - Andre Smith OT Alabama
Cincy needs O-line depth. They lost their starting ROT to FA to Philly, and the current LOT starter has knee issues. Even if they feel Collins or Whitworth fits at LOT, they still have the hole at ROT. Smith is huge, and could be a solid RT and possibly the LT of the future.

Spike 1 - Monroe is there and cincy happily dances to the beat to take him.

Spike 2 - Crabtree or Curry are there, and they take a trade down so they can still get Smith...and extra picks. This would be the smart thing to do though...so don't hold your breath.

Spike 3 - They shock everyone by taking Crabtree, which then allows them to trade COC to either NY Giants or the Philadelphia Eagles for a late first round pick. They could then address OT there with Britton or Oher or Beatty. This would really spike the draft as Arizona would be screwed by not getting huge picks for Boldin, and being stuck again with a disgruntled player. I would LOVE to see this one. It won't happen, but it would really make the draft fun.

Pick #7 Oakland - Jerry Maclin Wr Missouri
Lets face it, it is a need area. So is O-line, D-line and some other key areas. But with Qb situation now solid (Garcia signing), and a solid running game...they need some receiving talent to help the young Qb.

Spike 1 - They go Raji here to tighten up an already solid Def. No real issues on rest of draft, other than Jags get the Wr they truly need if Crabtree is gone.

Spike 2 - Trade down to Jets to allow the Jets to take Qb they have to get. Whether it is Freeman or Sanchez if still there. Good move for Oakland as they can still get Jerry at Jets pick, or OT possibility as well...and extra picks.

Pick #8 Jacksonville - B.J. Raji DT Boston College
This assumes both Crabtree and Maclin are gone. He is without a doubt the best DT in this draft, and will make the young DEs they took last year even better.

Spike 1 - One or both Wrs are there, and they get the much, much needed Wr they need.

Spike 2 - They need Wr, and trade down to Jets so that Qb can be taken by Jets and they can still get Wr later in Heyward - Bay or Britt or Nicks later at Jets pick.

Pick #9 Green Bay - Brian Orakpo DE/LB Texas
Converting to a 3-4 defense and they need the tweener to do it. Would be a huge help in that transition.

Spike 1 - Take an OT here if Smith is still there. Their line was okay..but it is getting older. Smith would be a solid youth movement.

Spike 2 - Go Cb to fix that issue...so take Jenkins here.



Well that is pretty much the farthest I will go. San Fran will take the best that is left as they have multiple needs...or trade down if Qb is there for Jets to take.
Well, well, well, now the real trash and rumors are flying!

More and more I am hearing that Sanchez is a target for Seattle. I would really hope this is smoke to get someone to trade up......but St. Louis is also rumored as thinking Sanchez.

In fact McShay thinks if Curry goes #1, Sanchez will be the first Qb taken off the board...not Stafford. :wow:

Next rumor is Buffalo trying to trade up to Cleveland at #5 to get one of the top 3 tackles before Cincinnati. That could be fun :rolleyes:

Have multiple rumors that Jets know they won't get any of the top three...so are working a deal with either Washington for Campbell or Quinn from Cleveland.

I also wonder if KC goes Crabtree now to make up for the offensive weapon they just traded away in Gonzales!?!?!?!?

And the spikes just keep on coming ;)
 
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Sgt John

Sith Lord of T&A
I'm divided a bit on that observation, Sarge. Dorsey was a bit more highly regarded entering last year's draft, and he did his college thing against a much higher level of competition. And they'll both end up going within 4 picks of each other, more than likely.

I think Dorsey's going to be fine once they get some other pieces on the defense.


I expected more out of Dorsey. The team may have been bad but his individual performance wasnt awesome either.
 

Miller

Who Dey
Administrator
Well, well, well, now the real trash and rumors are flying!

More and more I am hearing that Sanchez is a target for Seattle. I would really hope this is smoke to get someone to trade up......but St. Louis is also rumored as thinking Sanchez.

In fact McShay thinks if Curry goes #1, Sanchez will be the first Qb taken off the board...not Stafford. :wow:

Next rumor is Buffalo trying to trade up to Cleveland at #5 to get one of the top 3 tackles before Cincinnati. That could be fun :rolleyes:

Have multiple rumors that Jets know they won't get any of the top three...so are working a deal with either Washington for Campbell or Quinn from Cleveland.

I also wonder if KC goes Crabtree now to make up for the offensive weapon they just traded away in Gonzales!?!?!?!?

And the spikes just keep on coming ;)
This will be one of the more unpredictable first rounds in recent memory IMO.
 

Phicinfan

Expert on nothing, opinionated on everything
Administrator
I just thought, this could be Miller's ultimate dream!!!!

I have heard rumors that rather Bufallo trades up, or Cleveland stands pat that the pick at #5 could be A.Smith. The thought being that Mangini wants a truck at RT to go with his stud at LT. I have to admit....with a team that will have to run....it is an intriguing idea.

That would force Cincy to trade down --> good for Miller
Or
Take Raji --> good for Miller.

So one wonders if Miller isn't going to have a fun draft day afterall!!;)
 

Miller

Who Dey
Administrator
Would love the trade down idea, but even if that happens I don't see them taking Raji with the Tank signing. Not that I completely agree with it, but with Peko, Sims, Johnson and Shirley, I feel they are conctent with their tackle rotation. If the top 2 tackles are gone, I feel they would be best served trading down, or taking Orakpo.
 
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